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Post by Jurate on Dec 28, 2005 10:43:56 GMT 1
Hi! I want to ask what you all guys know or ever heard about Wire-haired Weimaraners  I red an article that one Lithuanian girl wrote, and when she mention weimaraner types near shorthair and longhair there was wire-haired... I started to search cause I had never heard about wire-haired weim, but all I had find out that this has been discussed with many German breeders - Wirehaired Weimaraners are a myth. But I found that there are one mre coat type STOCKHAAR WEIMARANER: This is what I find: "Stockhaar is slightly longer than the short-haired variety and MUCH thicker. There is no way these dogs could be considered wirehaired. From a distance, they look shorthaired but are now registered as longhaired. German breeders have observed that the Stockhaar coat appears most frequently in litters from longhair-to-shorthair matings."   So what do You think? |
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Post by marjolein on Dec 28, 2005 11:17:24 GMT 1
That this is quite common. I've seen them, although I have never ever seen the wirehaired Weim.
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Post by daniela on Dec 28, 2005 11:30:27 GMT 1
Do you mean the Slovakian Rough Haired Pointer (Slovensky Hrubosrsty Stavac)?
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Post by Jurate on Dec 28, 2005 12:17:39 GMT 1
No... I mean wire-haired weims...  As I wrote I red an article where wire-haired weims were mentioned like a third type of weimaraners... So I just trying to find out was this just a mistake, and to hear Your opinion about all that... Slovakian Wirehaired Pointer is a diferent breed, but as I red, once it was trying to register it like wirehaired weimaraners, but German Klub did not agree to do so. They really have much in common with weims...   So maybe cause Slovakian Wirehaired Pointer is so similar to Weimaraner, myth about weirhaired weims was born...  |
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Post by marjolein on Dec 28, 2005 12:59:32 GMT 1
No, as far as I know they sure did excist. So I don't think it's a myth. Maybe some more knowledgeable people can help out?
I adore the SRHP btw. I think it's gorgeous!!!!
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Post by daniela on Dec 28, 2005 13:16:14 GMT 1
Personally, I think the 'Wirehaired' Weimaraner is what we now know as the Slovakian Rough Haired Pointer or Slovensky Hrubosrsty Stavac.
You are correct, in that the SRP was attempted to be recognised as the Wirehaired Weimaraner. I have a huge file at work about this, as I have done a lot of research about the SRP. I can't remember whether it was the German Kennel Club or the German Weimaraner Club who didn't agree that he should be called a Wirehaired Weimaraner but you are most certainly right.
Unfortunately, I am not back at work until next week otherwise I would check for you.
If you look in Gillian Burgoin's book, there is a fabulous picture of what is labelled a Wirehaired Weimaraner - and to my eye, this looks like what we know as the Slovakian Rough Haired Pointer.
However, whilst the SRP may have all the makings of a Weimaraner in terms of appearance but will a rough coat, they are most certainly different in character.
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Post by ralph on Dec 28, 2005 13:28:05 GMT 1
No, as far as I know they sure did excist. So I don't think it's a myth. Maybe some more knowledgeable people can help out? I adore the SRHP btw. I think it's gorgeous!!!! Not that i'm more knwledgeable (just more time on my hands ;)but they did exist. Wired haired weimaraners were called stock haar in dutch. Till 1969 they were discribed in the breeding standard. After that year they confined the discripton to SH and LH cause the WH became a very rare appaerance. Besides that, the WH that were walking the face of the earth weren't realy WH's anymore. They had become extinct so to speak. source: "de weimaraner" written by Mr. J.A.M. Deckers. gr. Ralph |
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Post by greydove on Dec 28, 2005 22:20:53 GMT 1
I love the SRHP I think they are gorgeous to the point that I submitted breed approval in Australia about 18 months ago....unfortunately rules were changed around the same time that the animal had to be resident in Australia before the dog would be approved and I don't think its viable to spend such money before I know the Canine Control will approve the breed...I have challenged this new rule brought around the same time my application was approved by our State Controlling body but it seems there was an issue with the National body...shame, they are beautiful dogs....until later I guess I shall just have to admire Daniela's !
Narelle
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Post by greydove on Dec 28, 2005 22:22:58 GMT 1
Our Rosie, CH Kadma Xtra Special Sage AI had similar markings on her neck but we never believed she carried a longhair gene, then we bred her to a LHC and her daughter Tara has the same markings...I do think tara is a LHC as these marking and the hair is quite thick and longer than usual and wavy....
Narelle
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syrinx
Intermediate
Posts: 335
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Post by syrinx on Dec 28, 2005 23:04:06 GMT 1
I think there are some interesting things in these breeds. We get a couple of GSP's in to board who have that same wave and thicker coat, even down to tail. One of them has an undocked tail, and enough hair to never have damaged it. Also, a friend of mine who has Vislas, had a pup with a coat like a LH Wei pop up in a litter a couple of years ago. Maree has bred a litter of her GSP's that go back to old lines on both sides, and as I recall they have good thick coats like that. Is that right, Maree???
Wendy
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Post by Alkemist on Dec 29, 2005 0:04:38 GMT 1
My first weim has longhairs in his pedigree, and he has this type of 'stockhaar' coat along his back. I have always mentioned this 'coat fault' to other peeps who said that they had never heard of it, so thanks for giving it a name. It was just like a chessboard type pattern (but smaller) in his coat.
Nina
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Post by Jurate on Dec 29, 2005 7:39:53 GMT 1
Daniela, it would be great if You could chek it when You be back to work, I don't even dear to ask, but I really would like to read Your work... I really want to learn more about it... |
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Post by daniela on Dec 29, 2005 11:16:38 GMT 1
Well yesterday I turned the house upside down looking for my SRP file and it's not here so it must be at work.
I can certainly scan anything that may be of interest and email it over to you.
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Post by daniela on Dec 29, 2005 11:31:49 GMT 1
That's interesting. What explanation were you given for the new rule change? Are there many breeds already recognised there? Are the breeds 'vetted' before they are recognised? I guess they must be otherwise, they can't 'police' the new ruling?
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Post by christina on Dec 29, 2005 14:36:14 GMT 1
Hello everyone,
I am reading this thread with great interest, and maybe you knowledgeable guys can give me some clues. I am at the end of my wisdom with this one.
My Weimaraner Kimber, now just under 8 years old, used to be a beautiful, silver grey puppy. At the age of about 8 months his coat started to change. It became coarse, very dense (like an undercoat, but somehow different) gradually took on a very ginger tinge, and the hairs became worn, very sharp to the touch, and the tips were getting thin and curved. When you look very closely it is evident that he has a multiple of hair colours too, ranging from very dark to very light, and they are of varying length. His coat does not appear to grow at all for very long periods of times and he also good as *never* moults - he has moulted 3 times in 8 years. The first two times for a normal period of time, the third time for 10 weeks solid - nothing since.... the last time was nearly 2 years ago. Has anyone ever come across anything like it in Weims? Could this be what you call "Stockhaar" Weim ??
I do have two really good macro shots of his coat, which I would like to attach for you to see - only I haven't got a clue how to go about it. I tried to understand the instruction in the picture section, but I am totally useless when it comes to technical instructions. I do know how to attach pics to normal e-mails though, so I shall send those two pics to Irena via pm, in the hope that she can somehow transfer it to here (thanks in advance, Irena)
Christina
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Post by daniela on Dec 29, 2005 15:11:09 GMT 1
It will be interesting to see the pictures if they can be posted.
The first thing I would ask, is what are you feeding him, as perhaps that may explain the coat growth ....or perhaps this is attributed to his AI?
Secondly, the ginger tinge, has he been in the sun?
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Post by christina on Dec 29, 2005 16:33:11 GMT 1
Hi Daniela,
I hope Irena is around to do this for me - but if she isn't, then I would be quite happy to send those pics to anybody else who can master the transfer <G> - one of them may have to be slightly reduced in size too .....
Kimber has been on a raw meaty bone diet since the tender age of 9 weeks. It's mostly raw chicken backs and wings - but also any other meaty bones that are not too hard. Quite often he also gets Naturediet. He has no problems on either. His IBD is stable, so is his Hypothyroidism.
Yes, it *could* be related to his AI. Hypothyroidism is an endocrine illness. We also found out that he produces too much sex hormone - which is also an endocrine problem. Hair growth is also linked to hormone production, which again is endocrine .... so the fact that he has abnormal (or rather near non-existent) hair growth cycles is probably also linked up with his whole endocrine system. I suspect, but have no proof, that his awful coat is due to wear and tear, since his coat never appears to renew itself..... I just find it so strange that I have never come across anything similar in Weims. Kimber's pedigree shows very well known Weims, lots of Sh. Ch. - maternal side mostly German lines, and on the paternal side only too well known American lines. Those ancestors of his have been used extensively in the UK and all over Europe - so why can't I find anyone else with this problem ??
Sun - ? Well, no more than any other UK family dog. He lives in the house, and we do have a big garden. He does not spend excessive amounts of time in the baking sun..... - something I have noticed though, is that most hypothyroid Weims that I know have developed a ginger tinge to their coat - all Weims that started off totally grey. But none of them got it as bad as Kimber. Kimber looks more like a Vizsla than a Weim....
Christina
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Post by daniela on Dec 29, 2005 18:24:54 GMT 1
Well you got me, I have never come across anything like this either.  Regarding the ginger tinge, I have noticed that dogs who live outside tend to get a ginger tinge in their coat especially during the summer months. When we rescued a dog back, he came to us with a terrible orange coat, he was almost ginger all over but soon as he settled in the home his coat reverted back to the silver grey shade we had seen in his youth. I don't think it's uncommon for Weimaraners' coats to go a little ginger in the sun but they usually shed this out and revert back to silver grey. |
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Post by Jurate on Dec 29, 2005 19:17:00 GMT 1
Daniela, that would be great if You could send me some info  My curent email has to be visible on this forum, but in case it is jurate.rancyte@gmail.com |
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Post by christina on Dec 29, 2005 19:19:42 GMT 1
A little ginger I could live with ... but Kimber it totally ginger all over - except for the head - that's always been "normal" hair and normal colour .... really weird! Don't get me wrong, I love him to bits, awful coat or not, but I would like to get to the bottom of this.
Christina
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