indy
Puppy
Indy - Pasquinel's Ahanu
Posts: 132
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Post by indy on Nov 8, 2006 9:32:39 GMT 1
Honestly.. here in Sweden we do not dock the dogs and I have never heard of anyone having problems!!
Maybe it's so that the quality of the docked dog's tails are poorer than those that do not dock?? If you dock the tail and breed on the docked dog, you don't know anything about the quality of the tail. .. many docked dogs that I have seen (imports) run with their tail straight up like a terrier.. now thats not right is it?! Doesn't look good anyway.
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Post by emma on Nov 20, 2006 10:12:50 GMT 1
I agree with Indy. I don´t think undocked dogs hurt themselves in the tail just because they have a tail  I mean there are many breeds with similar tails that are never docked and they don´t encounter any problems so why should this happen only for weims? I have had a dalmatian and they have a similar tail but they are never docked. No problems there. Yes, I know, dalmatians are not hunting dogs but on the other hand, there are so many show weims that never get to hunt so I don´t see the problem there. I think all dogs have a right to their tails, they express so many things with their tail. Just this morning my weim Aku started pointing a bird in the bushes and his tail was totally stiff and straight of excitement. It was great to see |
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Lois
Puppy
Posts: 171
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Post by Lois on Nov 24, 2006 23:59:47 GMT 1
I HATE docking tails, but like the look of the shorter tail.
My first undocked litter (docking is banned here in Australia) took me a long tome to get used to. Now I don't even notice Sabi's long tail. I like her tail because it is very strong and thick. I have seen a lot of undocked tails that are thin and fine and they look terrible and the dogs carry them up over their back.
Sabi doesn't carry her tail up over her back. She will hold it out but not too high. I think it is something we have to get used to. Interesting that in this litter we had a wide range of lengths of tails. Sabi had the longest one, but they were all thick and strong.
For years we have bred for the high set tail that looks so flashy in the show ring. Now we have to think about getting the tail set lower!
Lois
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greyflyte
Intermediate
Am/NZ/Aust Ch Tri-D's Greyflyte Grand Slam (Imp USA)
Posts: 318
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Post by greyflyte on Nov 25, 2006 19:56:22 GMT 1
Hi Lois,
I have been thinking about tails ever since the prospect of banning was introduced. I thought it would be interesting to have a tail like a Pointer, shorter, finer and carried straight out.............now where to find one!!!!!
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Lois
Puppy
Posts: 171
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Post by Lois on Nov 25, 2006 23:48:07 GMT 1
Well good luck Cyd! I have seen fine tails on undocked (and only slightly docked so that they are supposed to look undocked!) and they look awful. Very fine and whippy and carried over the back. At least with the heavier tails they seem to hold them lower but it might be just the lower tail set. We had a NZ judge here yesterday, Mr C Walker and he gave 'Sabi' Minor In Group from a huge lineup. He commented on how promising she was and when Claire mentioned the tail, he said it didn't worry him and he used to have GSPs. Here is a photo of Sabi who has finally grown some legs and is as tall as her mother now!  Lois |
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greyflyte
Intermediate
Am/NZ/Aust Ch Tri-D's Greyflyte Grand Slam (Imp USA)
Posts: 318
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Post by greyflyte on Nov 26, 2006 4:20:06 GMT 1
Well done with Sabi Lois, I know Colin Walker well, she is coming on really well.
We are still fighting the good fight here in Nz, hopefully I will get one or two more litters in before they ban it, cant see me being keen to have an undocked wei so might be tinme to quit then..........
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Post by Wetdog on Nov 26, 2006 18:08:27 GMT 1
According to the FCI standard it is:
According to the AKC standard, it is also correct(since we are talking about imports):
Maybe not to you, but I wouldn't want a dog that doesn't carry an erect tail.
The main reason for docking will become clear very quickly if you try standing in a group of excited dogs with happy tails--it can be just like having someone whacking you on the legs with a broomstick---very hard. Also, if you live with large dogs in a small house or apartment.
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Post by heidi on Dec 4, 2006 12:49:46 GMT 1
Undocked:) I know allot of Wei's here in Perth that have beautiful full tails with out any problems including my own. My dogs are inside, in the car, tracking, agility, playing with each other & not even one tail injury. People can get so stuck with all they know & have been taught that they are afraid of change. Do we dock all Dalmatian tails as they have a tail like a whip around the home & it might get hurt.......no. So how do we draw the line? A child may one day break a finger, should we get it cut off at birth? Tails are used allot more than just wagging when they are happy. Dogs use their tails to communicate to other dogs, for example in the park when they first meet to give an indication of their body language. Without a tail giving a clear sign of communication from afar the dogs have to get closer to one another to read other language. Their are allot more reasons why dogs were given tails so who are we to take them off? I believe a big reason why people dock is for showing in the ring & so that people don't have to worry about their coffee cup being knocked of the lounge room coffee table at home. But these people won't admitt it. Just my thoughts guys  |
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indy
Puppy
Indy - Pasquinel's Ahanu
Posts: 132
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Post by indy on Dec 4, 2006 13:39:40 GMT 1
 Thios is NOT how a weim should carry it's tail... but I have seen those that do. (took a neutral pic..) |
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Post by weimaranermama on Dec 4, 2006 14:05:44 GMT 1
Oh Indy, what a nice pic. And indeed, this is not the carriing what weims have to do, but in the American lines it is use to do it this way. Maby they can see the short tail better in the field, when it is standing like this terrier?  |
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indy
Puppy
Indy - Pasquinel's Ahanu
Posts: 132
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Post by indy on Dec 4, 2006 15:05:21 GMT 1
Then they should see an undocked correct tail even better |
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Post by marjolein on Dec 4, 2006 15:48:15 GMT 1
This is so common in the US. Don't know much about the showing, but I do know a bit about field trials. They actually train a dog to point with a tail set so high, you wouldn't believe it.
I don't really like the high tail set tbh and I really think it affects the movement as well. The back can never be as supple as the back of a dog with a normal tail set. JMHO.
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Post by weimaranermama on Dec 4, 2006 16:21:36 GMT 1
 Indy, i think you like this way to carry the tail better? The back is than better too i think. Ina |
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Post by weimaranermama on Dec 4, 2006 16:48:20 GMT 1
 I think this is the good tail set. Also the lenght is okee and this tail is not thin. In Zweden and Australia, there are a lot of Longhair carriers and maby? ?that's why the tail is not to thin and has good hair on it. Ina |
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Post by Jurate on Dec 5, 2006 9:42:29 GMT 1
I think the tail problem is not only in our breed, for example how much English Setter do You see in this dog? (I think this is an example what Indy means about "terrier" tail set)  This is working line English Setter, just look at his tail, and he is a very "good" reproductor...  I would recognize a breed only by the color... Or this one  I would like to believe this won't happen to weimaraner.... |
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Post by marjolein on Dec 5, 2006 11:32:49 GMT 1
Look for pictures of American Weims on point and you'll see a tail set just like that.
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Post by fialCo on Dec 5, 2006 11:39:52 GMT 1
fuf, I don't like it!!! I like my dog keeping her tail straight to the back line:)
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Post by Jurate on Dec 6, 2006 10:49:59 GMT 1
Maybe it will sound funny and silly, but if the dog has a long tail and he points carrying in like a terrier, so isn't he more visible? Well for a bird for example? Or couldn't that high staring tail flush birds? It looks very unnatural... I think when dog point tail should be in back level, and when Uoga does it her tail is in a back level and a bit wavy... |
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Post by marjolein on Dec 6, 2006 12:25:58 GMT 1
No, isn't more visible for birds. It's just because they like the looks of it. When a dog is on point, the tail should be carried somewhat above level or lower (FCI-standard) and should be perfectly still. When it's wavy, it's usually hare or a track they're pointing at, which they don't want to see here in Holland.
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Post by Jurate on Dec 6, 2006 13:17:58 GMT 1
Interesting about wavy tail. Hope You don't mind if I'll put picture of Dann from Your web site here. If You are, just say, and I'll move it. So this is how it looks when dog point some furry?  Uoga holds her tail something like that just in a level... So is it wrong? And why it is unaccetable in Holland? |
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