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Post by heidi on Dec 10, 2006 4:44:03 GMT 1
Hello,
I have a dream to have one of all coated Weimaraners.
I have a short coat & a long coat grey at the moment but would someday love to import a Blue.
I would have to get him sent from another Country or have some frozen sperm sent over here to Australia of a Blue & find a breeder who would breed from it.
Does any other Aussie's have this desire?
Thanks
Heidi
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Lois
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Post by Lois on Dec 10, 2006 7:56:47 GMT 1
Hi Heidi
I can't say I ever want to see a Blue here in Australia. The color is not a recognized color here although I must agree it is a stunning color. There seems to be such controversy behind how the color came about. Most common theory is that it is the result of cross breeding. I guess as a breeder I want to protect the purity of our breed. If you went to the expense of bringing in a blue or semen from a blue dog, you would not be able to register any pups here with our Canine Association.
Lois
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Post by heidi on Dec 10, 2006 10:30:48 GMT 1
That does not bother me Lois not regestiring the Blue here nor that they are not reconized with Canine association as I do not want to show or breed from it. It would be for Tracking & Retreiving & just to have a wonderful Blue as a heathy companion to join out pack here at home I understand it would be a challenge to find a breeder who would breed them as the pups can not be registerd. Prehaps the best method for me would be to import one from a good breeder oversea's. Here is a website u may be interested in regarding more about the Blue's & how they came about. www.blueweimaraner.comCheers Heidi
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Post by Jaeger on Dec 10, 2006 11:35:41 GMT 1
I have an address for you. Found it on an American Weimaraner site. They announce it as "AKC Weimaraner puppies - Ready By Christmas - All Colors", not only blue, but also brown or black. You see that is the country for all (mixed) breeds. here is the site www.livedeal.com/showItemDetail?id=18785691
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Lois
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Posts: 171
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Post by Lois on Dec 10, 2006 12:18:08 GMT 1
Hi Heidi Yes I have seen that website before. Maybe you could get a few from the site Jaeger posted, one of each colour Seems like the AKC will register any colour!! Maybe we will see some spotted ones soon LOL Good luck in your quest for a blue. Would be the first for this country I think. Regards Lois
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tasha
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Post by tasha on Dec 10, 2006 15:15:50 GMT 1
come on now girls be nice.
Heidi if you genuinely want a blue dog and don't want it for breeding, showing and only as a pet then why not do something that will benefit yourself and the breed buy a dog or bitch puppy have it shipped in and NEUTER it. Why breed a whole litter of puppies? They will spoil the breed in your country. why not keep it special just for you and only have one, let someone else be the person who gets the grief.
That way you get your puppy and the rest of the breeders in australia can breathe a sigh of relief. The blue dogs are a mix, genetically its just not possible to have a blue weimaraner and sadly some people are breeding these dogs for money because of other peoples commercial need for something rare... dogs were never meant to be a commodity, believe me they are not rare one look at america will give you the fate of the so called rare weimaraner if the puppies from the litter above can be registered then the american kennel club should be ashamed.
If your looking to make some money out of dogs don't its a false economy.
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Lois
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Post by Lois on Dec 10, 2006 21:43:18 GMT 1
Hi Tasha
I think you have mis-read Heidi's post as she said she was not interested in breeding blues. Also my comments about spotted ones etc were made in jest. I don't think there was any ill feelings expressed in any of our posts.
Regards
Lois
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tasha
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Post by tasha on Dec 11, 2006 16:16:06 GMT 1
if she used an AI sperm and gets someone else to breed a litter that is still breeding even if its indirect... its ok I got the spotty dog jest :-)
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Post by lizgundog on Dec 11, 2006 21:57:57 GMT 1
Heidi, I think you would have trouble registering a blue in Australia to start with. Our colours are listed on our pedigrees, you would have check with the ANKC as to whether you could register it on the limited register so that you could go tracking and retrieving, don't forget unregistered dogs can't compete in retrieving, we have associate tracking in Victoria but not associate retrieving trials. Liz - Silvahunter.
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Post by anne on Dec 12, 2006 4:46:28 GMT 1
Hi Heidi, That's my website you found (blueweimaraner.com). Please note the comments on the site about how VERY few good breeders there are out there breeding Blues. Your best bet is to import one from the two (yes, count them, TWO) breeders that I know of worldwide that are breeding Blues with any kind of ethics. And you will have to wait.... If you are serious about this, just know that you are possibly opening a big can of worms in your country. They are not rare here in the US and it's still very controversial. Anne
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Post by jai on Jan 2, 2007 22:13:08 GMT 1
Good Luck to you Heidi.. i too think that the blue wiem is a beautiful and attractive looking dog. I have looked at several websites and asked many questions.. as for the can of worms, progress is part of the future. jai
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Post by Jaeger on Jan 3, 2007 0:17:59 GMT 1
What is the purpose. Mankind developped all the different breed, and now we are going to breed in all colors of the rainbow. What will be next, green weimaraners? Isn''t it enough to breed to the standard and especially a 'healthy' Weimaraner.
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tasha
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Post by tasha on Jan 3, 2007 2:43:50 GMT 1
Isn''t it enough to breed to the standard and especially a 'healthy' Weimaraner. Think thats a hard enough job in itself and something that all of us strive for ;D
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Post by anne on Jan 3, 2007 7:37:53 GMT 1
Jaeger,
I didn't say anything earlier about this comment you made in a previous post
which I just scratched my head puzzled about why the disparaging tone....
Now with the green Weim comparison, I can't help but point out the irony.... We are allowed a lot of freedom, the bad side of which produces the example ad you shared from livedeal.com. The flip side is that this freedom nutures greatness, greatness that some people in other countries make a great deal of effort to bring into their own countries. Blues are a part of the HERITAGE of American Weims whether people want to admit or not. As much as many frown on the blues that we have here, they should also realize that the dogs they are bringing into their country probably has blue in the background.
Anne
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tasha
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Post by tasha on Jan 3, 2007 17:57:06 GMT 1
I could give you a list of some of the best kennels in the uk that have a blue in their dogs.
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Post by weimslover on Jan 5, 2007 0:23:00 GMT 1
I don't know why I love to get in the middle of some of these politically charged arguments but for some reason I feel I need to Anne is exactly right here !!! While Kim and I do NOT breed blue Weims, we have rescued and found homes for a couple and I have hunted behind a few. The ones I have seen are fantastic bird dogs. Maybe some of this drive goes back to the talented blue Weim originally sent to the U.S. I don't mean to upset any show people BUT IMO blue Weims have not had the non hunting show dogs bred to them to spoil their drive in the field. For the life of me I can't understand why so many people from so many countries are getting this upset about the blue Weim Let's say that some of you are correct about blues originally being cross bred. Well over 50 years have passed since the first blue Weim was introduced into the U.S. How can anyone still call this a crossbred not matter how it originated The WCA does not endorse the breeding of blues or longhairs in the U.S. but talk to many of the best U.S. breeders and they will tell of many benefits of introducing the longhair gene into your lines. Personally I LOVE the look of a longhair Weimaraner. Maybe some of these non hunting show dogs we have in the U.S. could use a little influx of blue to help their drive in the field Who knows but why not give them that choice It is somewhat ridiculous for good U.S. show and field breeders to breed either longhairs or blues for the fact you can't enter them in shows. You can enter them in field trials but there is another can of worms. That is why there are so many poorly bred blue weims out there. BUT MOST CAN STILL HUNT !!! As most of you know Anne owns a Dual Ch (Riley). That is an accomplishment most of us will never see happen. I'll bet if you ask Anne she would tell you her blue Weim is just as talented as her Dual Ch but he doesn't have the same opportunities. I know her blue has won a field trial in the U.S. which is really NO surprise to this guy who loves to hunt Dan Wendel Winsome Weims
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tasha
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Post by tasha on Jan 5, 2007 4:53:23 GMT 1
Part of the problem is that for our american friends this is an old debate but for everyone else especially those from mainland europe where the american dogs have not had such an impact on their lines this is something new and important. Even though the blues have had an influence on alot of american exports that have added to other countries lines most people don't recognise that contribution because they haven't actually seen a blue dog and its not in their 5 generation pedigree. Seeing one in the flesh is a whole different kettle of fish.
Ask any breed how they feel about the introduction of a rogue element and most will have the same reaction... if you make an exception then whats the point of a specific breed?
I post in these discussion more as devils advocate than personal opinion but it is an interesting topic that I am sure will go on for many more years to come.
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Post by anne on Jan 5, 2007 8:32:29 GMT 1
Tasha, I think you make a good point in that what is old hat argument for us in the US is for many something new and shocking to hear about. The shock value however is in the whole cross breeding thing. It very well may be true, we will never know if the genesis of blues was due to cross breeding. The problem is that there are other theories** out there that are just as strongly supportable as the cross bred theory, but people like a fantastic tale, and myths get perpetuated.... Ask any breed how they feel about the introduction of a rogue element and most will have the same reaction... if you make an exception then whats the point of a specific breed? That's my point. The first thing people bring up is ::alarm! alarm!:: blues are products of cross-breeding! Oh the horror! There are other theories, maybe far more boring, but just as strongly supportable. So is your rogue element really a rogue element? Most people don't bother to know. It's easier to just shun them. Which would be fine except, there are SO many well-bred dogs that go back to Casar, it's unescapable that he is a part of the heritage of the American Weimaraner. This isn't comparable to -doodles or rainbow colored Weims and comparing them to such is a slight to American breeders. You have to remember that Casar's dam was the dam of one of the 4 dogs from Germany that constitute the American foundation stock. The Weim Club of America was formed in 1942 and the Weim was a post WWII dog, Casar also being a post WWII dog, we are talking about an early contributor to the breed in this country. Incidentally, the blue was specifically named as an acceptable color in the 1944 standard, 3 years before Casar is even born.... Casar was used by many prominent breeders of that time and was a top producing sire. (Hmmmm a crossbred dog a top producing sire???) He's in many many pedigrees, and if not him, then his maternal half-sibling is. As much as I think we have a long way to go, I also think that Americans have produced some world class dogs both in show and field. Casar, the "first" Blue Weim, was a part of that heritage in a big way. So is he really a rogue element? Is it really fair to compare Blue Weims to green and polkadots? Anne ** To read about the other theories, go to blueweimaraner.com/tell.html
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Post by anne on Jan 5, 2007 9:04:47 GMT 1
Wow, Dan, thanks for the props! It's actually kind of ironic. My blue really embodies a lot of what I think a Weim should be. She is a good little meat dog.
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Lois
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Post by Lois on Jan 5, 2007 9:35:19 GMT 1
What I don't understand, and I guess that makes me sceptical, is that with all the US dogs that have been used here in Australia, I have never heard of any blues being born here. I think I am pretty much 'in the know' with what is happening in the breed here but maybe I have missed something. Suzy, Liz, Lanie, Carol??? With the variety of US lines used here surely a blue would have cropped up sooner or later if it was so common.
I guess the argument for their acceptance is not being helped by the fact that a lot of 'backyard' and puppy mills have profited on the novelty aspect of the color, much like the 'silver' Labradors.
Are blues common in any other country? What specific lines do they go back to does any one know?
Lois
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